Is McCain losing his mind?

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Harlowe
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Is McCain losing his mind?

Post by Harlowe »

What has happened to the McCain of 8 years ago? It's like he's become a bitter, old senile man that is all over the place with his answers, stomping his feet and throwing a fit because he's not treated like the media darling he was 8 years ago when the man actually behaved more like the self-titled "Maverick". The way he responds to questions (the economy, Italy and lies, lies, lies) how petulant and childish he is, the swearing, the indignation, the sleazy campaign, the choice of Palin - is he drunk, senile or desperate? He doesn't get it, but damn if he doesn't just want it so bad, that he'll do anything to get there.

Republican on Palin...
http://www.omaha.com/index.php?u_page=2 ... d=10435997
"I think they ought to be just honest about it and stop the nonsense about, 'I look out my window and I see Russia and so therefore I know something about Russia,'" he said. "That kind of thing is insulting to the American people."
Pro-McCain author on "How McCain Lost Me"
http://www.politico.com/news/stories/09 ... Page2.html

The Times "The Lying Game"
http://www.time.com/time/politics/artic ... 30,00.html

The Ugly New McCain
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/co ... 02406.html

Voter caging....numerous reports of this
http://votingmatters.wordpress.com/2008 ... -campaign/
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Re: Is McCain losing his mind?

Post by Harlowe »

Just adding another Voter Caging article.

http://www.truthout.org/article/nearly- ... aging-ohio
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Re: Is McCain losing his mind?

Post by Lurker »

Don't forget about the plans to disenfranchise people that lose their homes in Michigan.

But lets be clear, McCain was an unprincipled piece of shit in 2000, too. This isn't some new McCain we're seeing. Whatever he thinks he needs to do or say in the moment to get by.
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Re: Is McCain losing his mind?

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Caging is illegal when the voter-challenge list is used to exclude voters on the basis of race. Federal authorities have repeatedly stepped in to stop it. Obama officials said they had no evidence that the reported Michigan scheme was targeting minority voters.
You posted a non issue. This is the same tired thing the Democratic party pulls out every election. They push for voiting laws like same day registration to try to get as many questionable votes in as they can....yet question any Republican response to try to verify that those votes are in fact legal.

Every election they trot out the same old race horse.
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Re: Is McCain losing his mind?

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Links please.
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Re: Is McCain losing his mind?

Post by Embar Angylwrath »

In all fiarness to Pailin on the foreign policy issues.. really now.. do we expect state governors to have any real foreign policy experience?
Correction Mr. President, I DID build this, and please give Lurker a hug, we wouldn't want to damage his self-esteem.

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Re: Is McCain losing his mind?

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Embar wrote:do we expect state governors to have any real foreign policy experience?
No, but I do expect them to have shown some interest in the topic and to have some knowlege base to draw on when they form opinions and make decisions. Palin has proven that she has no experience and no knowlege base, and her ability to cram factoids into her head for a few weeks is meaningless. Factoids don't help someone reach good decisions.

Would you let someone with zero interest or experience in your job study up for a few weeks and take over your role at your company?
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Re: Is McCain losing his mind?

Post by Kulaf »

Jimmy Carter was a peanut farmer from bumfuck Georgia......yet turns out to be one of the greatest statesmen of my time.......go figure. Also.....if good ole Jimmy was running today......any bets on whether Harlowe would be starting threads on his religious views?
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Re: Is McCain losing his mind?

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Lurker wrote:Links please.
Do I really need to do a search on Klast and Partha's numerous posts from the last election? Even in the one Harlowe linked the Obama campaign said they have NO evidence the caging was targeting minorites......and that is the ONLY way it is illegal.
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Re: Is McCain losing his mind?

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Kulaf wrote:if good ole Jimmy was running today......any bets on whether Harlowe would be starting threads on his religious views?
Last I heard..... Jimmy Carter..... didn't ..... advocate the ..... banning of books..... or the teaching of ..... creationism in public schools..... and he didn't force women ..... to pay for their own rape kits if they were assaulted.... because rape kits contain emergency contraceptives..... and Carter wasn't a vindictive fuck that ..... abused the powers of office.... to punish adversaries....
Kulaf wrote:Do I really need to do a search on Klast and Partha's numerous posts from the last election?
No, just provide evidence that Democrats push for voting laws in an attempt to "try to get as many questionable votes in as they can" and that Republicans are engaging in caging operations in response to that.
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Re: Is McCain losing his mind?

Post by Harlowe »

Kulaf, diversionary tactics aren't going to work here. We're not your average joe-schmoe that gets their news in 15 second sound bites. If Jimmy Carter was tryng to push a religious agenda while in the white house, I sure as hell would have. He's before my time as a president though, so sorry, I wasn't involved.

This thread was about McCain's insanity and Palin sucking hind teet as a VP choice for NUMEROUS reasons. Her crazy ass, speaking in tongues, end of the world, fighting witchcraft religous agenda being only the cherry on the top of that shit sundae.
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Re: Is McCain losing his mind?

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Lurker wrote:
Embar wrote:do we expect state governors to have any real foreign policy experience?
No, but I do expect them to have shown some interest in the topic and to have some knowlege base to draw on when they form opinions and make decisions. Palin has proven that she has no experience and no knowlege base, and her ability to cram factoids into her head for a few weeks is meaningless. Factoids don't help someone reach good decisions.

Would you let someone with zero interest or experience in your job study up for a few weeks and take over your role at your company?
Speaking of that (an interest in world affairs and imagination in general), I saw this very thoughtful and articulate editorial on the Obama site from Sean Penn

SNIPPED....
I am no great fan of the Democratic Party, and have enormous disagreement and concern about many policies advocated in the Democrats' current platform. But there can be no doubt, that in a country of, for, and by the people, the only positive change that can be depended on, is a movement of imagination, aspiration, and will.

I watched both the Republican and Democratic Conventions through the same lens and found the most striking difference between the parties that I have witnessed in my lifetime. It wasn't a lens pointed at the candidates or their attack-dog speakers. It was a lens pointed at the crowd, the delegates, and the ordinary citizens that occupied those two very different halls. At the DNC, I absorbed the intense hope, passion, and readiness to participate in, and sacrifice for our country.

This was in sharp contrast to the Governor of Alaska, who actually poked fun at, indeed mocked, the constitutional rights of the criminally accused in our system, to the thunderous applause of Republican brothers and sisters wearing symbolic hard-hats emblazoned with the slogan "Drill now," and holding signs claiming "country first," like gluttons to fast-food neo-conservativism.


What country is it they're putting first? Is it a country in the service of their children's future or one serving the conceit of a deferred personal identity? The picture of Republicanism in America represented by their convention, seemed more a gathering of self-styled pseudo-cowboys and shallow-eyed Stepford wives, than one of a hearty and loyal opposition. In particular, I found myself taken aback by the instant will to embrace Palin as their new champion.

Full disclosure, I've spent a lot of time in Wasilla, Alaska, where she was mayor. I've even seen Wasilla booming. By that, I mean, an afternoon where, with a little effort, one could find three of four people on the streets. It's a beautiful town in a beautiful state. But, it's smaller than my children's pre-school. Since then, she's had a little less than two years in the governorship leading to a boldly received lie about a bridge at this year's convention. Is this really the e xample of earned and competent leadership that we want to put one heartbeat away from the presidency leading our children's country?

Or are we simply enabling Palin (declared by former Republican Senator Lincoln Chafee a "cocky wacko") the hubris of her reckless acceptance of John McCain's wildly irresponsible invitation? When did we start pridefully championing those who win the contest of lottery over those who offer substance, and those whose lifelong cultural and political curiosity has the limitations of a single sparsely populated state?

When will America be ready to rise like a real champion? I'm reminded of Muhammad Ali's legendary "Rope-A-Dope." He took punch after punch, wearing Foreman down with courage and strategy, because the great champion that he is, understood that it's not how many times you get knocked down, but how strongly you get up. This country has to start talking about a new kind of strong; has to have the real courage it takes to fight only when necessary, and to do so, in preservation of civil rights for our countrymen, but if we are to be a world leader, then for humankind as well.

Our republican-led nation did a great disservice to the young soldiers who were sent to fight in Vietnam. They were vilified, and fantastically unsupported upon their return from overseas. In many ways, one's political view of that, or any other war, is irrelevant to the responsibilities we have to our returning troops. Still, supporting troops, like supporting our own children, should not be blind. Indeed, before we can look upon troop actions with a critical eye, we must look upon our own.

Still when a presidential candidate's campaign, incessantly exploits their man's heroic mythology, not withstanding whatever courage one may appoint John McCain, the long unspoken historical context remains worthy of at least brief consideration. Captain John McCain was shot down during Operation Rolling Thunder over Vietnam. From all accounts, he, and many other Americans faced their imprisonment with courage and integrity. An estimated 52,000 Vietnamese civilians - -men, women, and children, were incinerated as a result of Rolling Thunder's bombardment. McCain himself, has acknowledged that his participation was not motivated by patriotism. But, rather, in the pursuit of personal glory. And to what end? Well, to the end that resulted in a national tragedy, a lost war, and throngs of American veterans, ignored by the country, by the very parties and people that sent and kept them there.

But despite the vainglorious devastation to both sides in that conflict, an unrepentant John McCain recently voted against veteran's benefits, those supported by his major opponent.

This odd dichotomy begs the question: If John McCain, in reflection, offers no support for those that served beside him, nor those who serve today, what has experience provided him?

And when a man regarded so highly in heroic terms of military service, confides personal glory as a common motivation to the young Americans who risk their lives, at what point would he acknowledge patriotism as something more considered than the glib hawkishness exulted by the Republican Convention? His choice of Palin is, once again, McCain's vainglorious head rising. It's about "winning," not serving. As Senator Joe Biden said this week, "Don't tell me your values, show me your budget and I'll tell you your values."

McCain values McCain. His blood boils every time his integrity is questioned, as though his five-year imprisonment allows him the arrogant assumption that he may tread on all that followed unquestioned. He was one of the Keating Five for good reason. Indeed McCain had abused his power as a Senator in lobbying for Keating. And it was not until he was tipped off by regulators of the criminal investigation of Lincoln Savings and Loan, that he severed relations with Keating. It was a little late. More than 21,000, mostly elderly investors, had lost their life savings. And, Cindy McCain's bookkeeping was not a thing apart. All the righteous indignation, or prior heroics one wants to advertise, does not change the pattern of self-service by this man of seven houses.

I can't help but reflect on the issues of health and homelessness that our Vietnam veterans faced for decades, just think of the tidal wave of veteran's issues about to return to our shores. John McCain claims the surge as a "victory." Well, it's no victory for the nearly 5,000 American dead. For the hundreds of thousands of civilian dead. It's no victory for the veterans who under this Republican administration, it has already been demonstrated, will not be served upon their return. It's no victory for our country to have a broken and depleted military, a broken and depleted economy, with so much work to be done at home on issues of healthcare, poverty, infrastructure, education, environment, and perhaps, most of all, security. And it's no victory, that in attacking the wrong country, we boosted Al Qaeda recruitment worldwide 300% (as we stop-loss our own.) Finally, it is no victory for our children, reared in an America of such divisive loathing, enormous debt, and tarnished standing.

Despite recent boasts to the contrary, by the Director of Homeland Security Michael Chertoff, (Bush's key bumbler of the Katrina debacle) our country is not safer. It is not safer from without, and it is not safer from within. The divisiveness brought on by the policies of George W. Bush and John McCain has created an emotional civil war. We have to ask ourselves, at what point emotions may even turn to violence here at home.

By and large, the media is going to do what's good for the media. If that means covering the McCain/Palin ticket for fashion, or fraud, assume fashion their more likely target. (While Americans died in the Middle East, Donald Rumsfeld was voted one of People Magazine's sexiest men.) Palin, married to an 8-year secessionist, has as much as admitted that she has no interest whatsoever in any culture but her own. It is that kind of lacking in basic curiosity and the void of insightfulness that comes with it which embodied George Bush's folksy failings.

This is simply the worst ticket in modern times. And the victory for this country begins with a unified refusal to accept, not only the McCain/Palin ticket, but also the static and shallow conscience of the Republican base. If we are to support hope, in a cycle of history that may be its last, then a vote for McCain/Palin is a vote for cowardice. A vote not backed up by demand and participation, is an impotent one. A vote for hope followed by demand and action to realize it -- is an American vote.
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Re: Is McCain losing his mind?

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More total about face behavior - his whole new take on regulation, corporate greed, holding companies responsible and claims that he'd fire people he actually can't fire is just mind-boggling. Up until weeks ago and for the past 26 years he's been saying call me "Mr. Deregulation" and he's been riding that train into town right next to his buddy Phil Gramm. How well has that worked out? How about the whole Lincoln Savings & Loan fiasco, maybe look at the whole Keating Five connection with McCain and the mess we have now.

http://www.azcentral.com/news/specials/ ... pter7.html
A decade ago, Sen. John McCain embraced legislation to broadly deregulate the banking and insurance industries, helping to sweep aside a thicket of rules established over decades in favor of a less restricted financial marketplace that proponents said would result in greater economic growth.

.... In 2002, McCain introduced a bill to deregulate the broadband Internet market, warning that "the potential for government interference with market forces is not limited to federal regulation." Three years earlier, McCain had joined with other Republicans to push through landmark legislation sponsored by then-Sen. Phil Gramm (Tex.), who is now an economic adviser to his campaign. The Gramm-Leach-Bliley Act aimed to make the country's financial institutions competitive by removing the Depression-era walls between banking, investment and insurance companies.

That bill allowed AIG to participate in the gold rush of a rapidly expanding global banking and investment market. But the legislation also helped pave the way for companies such as AIG and Lehman Brothers to become behemoths laden with bad loans and investments.
To be fair, moreso than McCain, I blame Phil Gramm for his hand in this bullshit state of affairs - but I agree with what many folks are speculating, he's probably someone that would make it into the position of McCain's Treasury Secretary and they are both fools when it comes to the economy.
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Re: Is McCain losing his mind?

Post by Embar Angylwrath »

Lurker wrote:
Embar wrote:do we expect state governors to have any real foreign policy experience?
No, but I do expect them to have shown some interest in the topic and to have some knowlege base to draw on when they form opinions and make decisions. Palin has proven that she has no experience and no knowlege base, and her ability to cram factoids into her head for a few weeks is meaningless. Factoids don't help someone reach good decisions.

Would you let someone with zero interest or experience in your job study up for a few weeks and take over your role at your company?
That might be a good analogy.. if Palin were to be running for President.. but she's not.

And it seems you're a little hypocritical on the issue, since Obama, who is gunning for the top spot, has just about the same foreign policy experience as Palin.
Correction Mr. President, I DID build this, and please give Lurker a hug, we wouldn't want to damage his self-esteem.

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Re: Is McCain losing his mind?

Post by Embar Angylwrath »

Harlowe -

Sean Penn married Madonna... I think that just about covers it in the "good judgment" category. And he's been a whacko extremist for a long time.

C'mon, I hope you can do better than Sean Penn.
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Re: Is McCain losing his mind?

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Embar wrote:That might be a good analogy.. if Palin were to be running for President.. but she's not.
She could be President by January if McCain wins. Doesn't bother you at all I'm guessing.
Embar wrote:And it seems you're a little hypocritical on the issue, since Obama, who is gunning for the top spot, has just about the same foreign policy experience as Palin.
You seem not to have read what I said. Try again.

Experience isn't the issue. Someone can have no actual experience but still have a working knowledge of a topic because they have an interest. Palin has neither knowledge or experience because she has no interest in those areas. Obama has shown a deep interest in areas of foreign policy. He has both knowledge and experience. Palin and Obama aren't even remotely comparable.
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Re: Is McCain losing his mind?

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Embar, if all you can get from everything I've posted is "well sean penn is an extremist whacko who was married to madonna like 20 years ago..." I think you can do better as well.

I'm saying, what he said resonated. It was a spot-on observation. Whether I like him or his social activism or not, what he said was a home run imo.
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Re: Is McCain losing his mind?

Post by Embar Angylwrath »

Lurker wrote:
Embar wrote:That might be a good analogy.. if Palin were to be running for President.. but she's not.
She could be President by January if McCain wins. Doesn't bother you at all I'm guessing.
Embar wrote:And it seems you're a little hypocritical on the issue, since Obama, who is gunning for the top spot, has just about the same foreign policy experience as Palin.
You seem not to have read what I said. Try again.

Experience isn't the issue. Someone can have no actual experience but still have a working knowledge of a topic because they have an interest. Palin has neither knowledge or experience because she has no interest in those areas. Obama has shown a deep interest in areas of foreign policy. He has both knowledge and experience. Palin and Obama aren't even remotely comparable.
But.. if Obama wins he WILL be president in January. He as 0 foreign policy exp. Why is there one bar for Palin, the second person in command, and another bar for Obama?
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Re: Is McCain losing his mind?

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How many times does he have to say experience is not the issue and actually Obama has traveled, he has interacted with other nations. He has taken an interest in the world around him. Palin just got a passport like last year and responds "you can see Russia from some parts of Alaska" (no joke) when she was asked.

Obama has standing and respect in the international arena whether you want to see it or not.

ETA IMO Obama also brings a new face of America to the world at large. After 8 years of tearing down bridges and being the ignorant, stubborn neighborhood bully, it's about time we had someone who could be strong and yet diplomatic. McCain isn't going to get that, hell he wants to continue having cool relations with Spain, a freakin' ally before he's even in office.
http://voices.washingtonpost.com/the-tr ... .html#more

This is not someone that is good for our economy nor for Foreign relations. Not by a long shot.
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Re: Is McCain losing his mind?

Post by Lurker »

What Harlowe said.

On one side you have Obama, who spoke out against the war in Iraq before it was authorized, listing all the reasons it was wrong to invade and was proved right even in hindsight, and on the other side you have Palin, who four years into the conflict admitted she hasn't given it a lot of thought.

Cue Embar with same question about both having no experience!
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