Occupation /global revolution

[Ddrak]

Anyway... you might want to check and see how much of middle America's retirement plans are managed by the evil bastards you're bitching about. Im betting that out of 100 people, if you asked them howm much they should pay someone who could double thier retirement savings in 7 years, the answer would be "whatever the fuck they want".

Given that the average retirement savings is around $30k, a very small number would be using the "evil bastards he's bitching about". If anyone says they can GUARANTEE a doubling of retirement savings in 7 years (compounded net annual return of over 10%), starting with that average of $30k then they are a liar. This goes even more so if you mean a doubling after discounting for inflation.

What you'll actually find is that while people would be happy to pay a reasonable commission of 1-2% (not "whatever the fuck they want", because that would probably be a significant margin of the average $30k increase you're talking about), especially if the "evil bastard" also paid some money back when the savings went down as they've done for the last few years instead of continuing to rake in weekly salaries that exceed a lot of people's yearly wage.

That's what gets me about people like Garrdor and others who rage against the "system"... they are willing participants in it as long as it works to their benefit. The evil corporations aren't so evil if you're downloading the newest killer app from the Apple store, or you're hogging bandwidth watching some Netflix movie on your smartphone.

Strawman. The OWS movement is largely complaining about banks and the financial sector, not Apple or Netflix. This is why it's called "Occupy Wall Street", not "Occupy Cupertino". They aren't complaining about companies that charge for a service that they actually deliver, they are complaining about the financial sector sucking in America's wealth and giving nothing back but a broken economy.

What's even worse is your statement that they are "willing participants as long as it works to their benefit" as if that's a bad thing. Are you suggesting that people should be a willing participant in something that doesn't benefit them? Please define your real meaning here because as far as I can see you're saying that people should bend over to be ass-fucked and say "thank you" when it's done.

Dd

[Jarochai Alabaster]

Exponentiate?

Anyway... you might want to check and see how much of middle America's retirement plans are managed by the evil bastards you're bitching about. Im betting that out of 100 people, if you asked them howm much they should pay someone who could double thier retirement savings in 7 years, the answer would be "whatever the fuck they want".

That's what gets me about people like Garrdor and others who rage against the "system"... they are willing participants in it as long as it works to their benefit. The evil corporations aren't so evil if you're downloading the newest killer app from the Apple store, or you're hogging bandwidth watching some Netflix movie on your smartphone.

Buncha ignorant hypocrites....

Translation.

[Harlowe]

Embar, come on guy, you can't honestly call someone else a hypocrite when you are a perfect example of a willing participant when something works to their benefit.

[Harlowe]

To be fair, pretty much all humans operate that way. Some just find that the greater good is a larger benefit to them personally.

You are certainly just as guilty of being a hypocrite as we all are, but I guess it's also human nature to be blind to our own hypocrisy and yet be gleefully and sanctimoniously willing to point it out in everyone else.

[Embar Angylwrath]

To be fair, pretty much all humans operate that way. Some just find that the greater good is a larger benefit to them personally.

You are certainly just as guilty of being a hypocrite as we all are, but I guess it's also human nature to be blind to our own hypocrisy and yet be gleefully and sanctimoniously willing to point it out in everyone else.

I fully embrace my own hypocrisy. Its more important to me than sex. I can't rmember a day when I didn't engage in some form of hypocrisy...

[Minute]

[Kulaf]

I think Minute is lobying for the idea that the people who head the FCC, Department of the Interior, Treasury, NRC, FDA, Department of Energy, etc. should be people with absolutly no experience at all.

[Minute]

Right, because the only way a person could know what's best for this country is by heading up a fortune 500 company.

[Arathena]

Maybe they shouldn't have a vested interest in draining billions of dollars from the nation at large or the state in specific.

[Garrdor]

Exponentiate?

Anyway... you might want to check and see how much of middle America's retirement plans are managed by the evil bastards you're bitching about. Im betting that out of 100 people, if you asked them howm much they should pay someone who could double thier retirement savings in 7 years, the answer would be "whatever the fuck they want".

That's what gets me about people like Garrdor and others who rage against the "system"... they are willing participants in it as long as it works to their benefit. The evil corporations aren't so evil if you're downloading the newest killer app from the Apple store, or you're hogging bandwidth watching some Netflix movie on your smartphone.

Buncha ignorant hypocrites....

Just caught this. I'll bite, you trolly motherfucker.

I'm unemployed and sleeping on my girlfriends mom's bedroom floor right now. Posting on her computer -- and it's NOT because I have motivational issues. No income. No jobs. The bus doesn't even come here. Also, the system might have treated you a little differently than I. You must get a neckache looking down from your pedestal. I'm not going to deny that OWS/Fight the power is also partially a youth-trend populated by privileged iphone kiddies. They exist. I am not one of them. Should I assume something about you now?

Let me ask you, how much money do you make a year? What do you drive? What phone are you using?
What sort of consumer is Mr. Angylwrath? Hopefully a very productive one! Oh geee!

*edit*
Just read this.

I fully embrace my own hypocrisy. Its more important to me than sex. I can't rmember a day when I didn't engage in some form of hypocrisy...

Gaw, what a rage-kill You sad sad man.

Trollbar Trollwrath. ..I.,

[Torakus]

I'm unemployed and sleeping on my girlfriends mom's bedroom floor right now. Posting on her computer -- and it's NOT because I have motivational issues.

I see your problem. Motivate yourself up into momma's bed and make yourself some candy!

[Embar Angylwrath]

@ Garrdor -

To answer some of your questions...

How much money I make is irrelevant. Just like just about everyone else, it doesn't seem enough sometimes.

I drive 2004 Toyota SUV, and the gas is killing me, since I commute about 100 miles/day. But its paid off, so I'm resistant to getting a new car with better gas mileage.

I have an Android, a couple years old.

I run/own a small business, so I put people like you to work (you're welcome). And if you think I'm an evil bastard with employees, you can ask a couple of other people on the board who have actually met me, visited where i work, and got to interact a bit with some of my employees.

As a side note.. if you put yourself in a position where work is hard to come by and you can't even get to it if you had a job because the bus doesn't run where you're at... what in the hell do you expect? Most people are where they are at in life largely due to their own choices. Accept that truism, and you won't be as bitter.

You're young enough , (I think) that you can take some risks. Do so, and you might see some reward. If you're living on your girlfriend's couch, it doesn't sound like you've got much to lose.

[Garrdor]

As a side note.. if you put yourself in a position where work is hard to come by and you can't even get to it if you had a job because the bus doesn't run where you're at... what in the hell do you expect? Most people are where they are at in life largely due to their own choices. Accept that truism, and you won't be as bitter.

Ok, boss!

Yeah - I chose all of this. There were options. Two of them. Take a wild guess what they were.

So I guess it's my fault for putting myself in this situation. Oh, and a 100 mile commute in a Toyota SUV? Daily? My wettest dream is to maybe(?) have the sort of income where that'd even be possible. "Doesn't seem enough sometimes" ? Well, that's understandable if you're literally burning a tank of gasoline a day.

Well, good luck with your business! Thanks for employing lesser beings like us! (seriously, I'm not just trying to be a dick because I'm poor. I just think you and I have two different lives with two different levels of opportunity or privilege)

[Embar Angylwrath]

You miss the point Garr...

Look dude, I grew up poor. Poor enough that I remember my dad pleading with the utility to please not turn off the gas and electric, he had kids, and it was fucking winter... in Kansas. Poor enough to eat bread fried in bacon grease, and be thankful for it. Poor enough to wear hand-me-downs, and I remember (with chagrin) of being embarrassed to wear them. I should have been thankful.

Poor enough to have to put myself through university. Poor enough to spend a few years paying off my college debt. Poor enough to live in a trailer park while I went to university. Poor enough that I didn't have the luxury of sleeping on my girlfriend's mother's couch, it was what I could provide for myself or dirt. Poor enough that dinner through my years of university were top ramen or wishing I had top ramen.

I rode a bike to university, couldn't afford the gas for my car or the parking fee. When my bike(s) were stolen (several times in that trailer park), I went to the police auction to get a new one if I had a spare ten bucks. I worked nights and went to school during the day. Later, i found a job where I could work around the clock on weekends, get OT, and then be free to go to school. So I did both, worked nights and weekends. Managed to scrape up enough to move into an apartment.

What's all this mean to you? Probably nothing, I don't think you're smart enough to get it. If you are smart enough, you'll understand that life isn't fair, and the American dream isn't a guarantee. You may think you're special, or you have circumstances that are unique. But you're not unique or special. You're a white male in the US, and that gives you a leg up on just about everyone else. If you can't make it here with those two things behind you, you really suck @ life.

That said, I hope you get out of the self-pity mode and into the self-actualization mode. Get off your ass and make something of yourself. You are the only person that can do that.

[Kulaf]

What your plan of action Garr? You still have options.....I know you might not feel like you do right now but you do. You need to start making some plans to improve your outlook.

[Partha]

You miss the point Garr...

Look dude, I grew up poor. Poor enough that I remember my dad pleading with the utility to please not turn off the gas and electric, he had kids, and it was fucking winter... in Kansas. Poor enough to eat bread fried in bacon grease, and be thankful for it. Poor enough to wear hand-me-downs, and I remember (with chagrin) of being embarrassed to wear them. I should have been thankful.

Poor enough to have to put myself through university. Poor enough to spend a few years paying off my college debt. Poor enough to live in a trailer park while I went to university. Poor enough that I didn't have the luxury of sleeping on my girlfriend's mother's couch, it was what I could provide for myself or dirt. Poor enough that dinner through my years of university were top ramen or wishing I had top ramen.

I rode a bike to university, couldn't afford the gas for my car or the parking fee. When my bike(s) were stolen (several times in that trailer park), I went to the police auction to get a new one if I had a spare ten bucks. I worked nights and went to school during the day. Later, i found a job where I could work around the clock on weekends, get OT, and then be free to go to school. So I did both, worked nights and weekends. Managed to scrape up enough to move into an apartment.

What's all this mean to you? Probably nothing, I don't think you're smart enough to get it. If you are smart enough, you'll understand that life isn't fair, and the American dream isn't a guarantee. You may think you're special, or you have circumstances that are unique. But you're not unique or special. You're a white male in the US, and that gives you a leg up on just about everyone else. If you can't make it here with those two things behind you, you really suck @ life.

That said, I hope you get out of the self-pity mode and into the self-actualization mode. Get off your ass and make something of yourself. You are the only person that can do that.

Perhaps, maybe, someday, when you realize that for every story like yours, there are thousands that end less well, and get the idea that you had to be lucky as well as good, even with that white privilege you argue against every time we discuss minorities, MAYBE you'll get the idea we've been trying to convey on these boards for years.

The idea isn't that I'm special, or that Garr is special (although I suspect there's a bit of troll there)....it's that your story is special enough that they make as much hay out of it as they do the millionaire athlete. Like it or not, your life isn't automatically reproducible no matter how much work you put into it, especially in a pyramidally structured economic/class society where the top end hoovers up all the opportunity and the scraps fall to the bottom of the pyramid.

In short, congratulations, you made it. Now try a different response to your life than "I got mine, fuck you."

[Raelesyn]

There are always options to get out of whatever situation anyone's in. It all depends on your work Ethic..If you want it bad enough you'll do it. I WAS one of them fathers pleading with the power company's not to turn us off in winter..with 4 kids..a wife who ran out cause things were getting too tough..but I stuck it out..I buckled down and did what I had to do. Everyone has options...Some might not like this or your physical limitations may prevent you from doing this but like I tell my kids...The military is always hiring. My youngest son is set to join the Airforce after he graduates...He is taking a page from my nephew who joined the Navy..saved EVERY dime lived on ship and put himself thru college and is now a Highschool teacher...

[MeGusta]

Perhaps, maybe, someday, when you realize that for every story like yours, there are thousands that end less well, and get the idea that you had to be lucky as well as good, even with that white privilege you argue against every time we discuss minorities, MAYBE you'll get the idea we've been trying to convey on these boards for years.

The idea isn't that I'm special, or that Garr is special (although I suspect there's a bit of troll there)....it's that your story is special enough that they make as much hay out of it as they do the millionaire athlete. Like it or not, your life isn't automatically reproducible no matter how much work you put into it, especially in a pyramidally structured economic/class society where the top end hoovers up all the opportunity and the scraps fall to the bottom of the pyramid.

In short, congratulations, you made it. Now try a different response to your life than "I got mine, fuck you."

I would like to see some specific points and reasons for the result you indicate.

I keep seeing this argument made from an emotional standpoint but it is typically very short on specific reasons why everyone could not do exactly what Embar did.

I have a similar self story to his. I know quite a few friends have similar circumstances. I do not think it is such a rare thing as described, though I will wait for specifics.

[Garrdor]

Freerepublic.com wrote:

You miss the point Garr...

Look dude, I grew up poor. Poor enough that I remember my dad pleading with the utility to please not turn off the gas and electric, he had kids, and it was fucking winter... in Kansas. Poor enough to eat bread fried in bacon grease, and be thankful for it. Poor enough to wear hand-me-downs, and I remember (with chagrin) of being embarrassed to wear them. I should have been thankful.

Poor enough to have to put myself through university. Poor enough to spend a few years paying off my college debt. Poor enough to live in a trailer park while I went to university. Poor enough that I didn't have the luxury of sleeping on my girlfriend's mother's couch, it was what I could provide for myself or dirt. Poor enough that dinner through my years of university were top ramen or wishing I had top ramen.

I rode a bike to university, couldn't afford the gas for my car or the parking fee. When my bike(s) were stolen (several times in that trailer park), I went to the police auction to get a new one if I had a spare ten bucks. I worked nights and went to school during the day. Later, i found a job where I could work around the clock on weekends, get OT, and then be free to go to school. So I did both, worked nights and weekends. Managed to scrape up enough to move into an apartment.

What's all this mean to you? Probably nothing, I don't think you're smart enough to get it. If you are smart enough, you'll understand that life isn't fair, and the American dream isn't a guarantee. You may think you're special, or you have circumstances that are unique. But you're not unique or special. You're a white male in the US, and that gives you a leg up on just about everyone else. If you can't make it here with those two things behind you, you really suck @ life.

That said, I hope you get out of the self-pity mode and into the self-actualization mode. Get off your ass and make something of yourself. You are the only person that can do that.

Woahhh... a Bootstraps argument. I didn't see that one coming Sorry you had a poor upbringing. See, I had a great one full of privilege. Didn't really matter once I left the nest. Everyone's struggling and poor now. Sounds like our plot and premise are opposites.

Life is hard, american dream isn't guaranteed, uhh i did it so can you, hmmm.

I don't want the McMerican dream. Fuck that. My parents worked hard and both got fucked by the system. My fathers insurance doesn't even pay for his lifesaving treatments. We have to do fundraisers. Mom lost her house and her job. I lost my job. My tooths infected. Etc etc etc. It doesn't matter. I could shout all day about how much me, my friends and family have been fucked over and over by the system despite everyones sacrifices and hard work. Social Mobility isn't what it was pre-2000s. 90% of the time, it works backwards and not forwards.

[MeGusta]

I lost my job.

How?